Diabetic Alert Dog forum - OUR ALERT SIGNAL

Tammy retrieves the meter!!!! (3 replies)

Bridget — Thu, 18 Feb 2010 06:26:56 -0700

She did it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I've been talking for weeks about how Tammy has been very mouthy while alerting, meaning after she alerts, she will find her tennis ball or chew bone & she treats it kind of like a "stress ball". Well, a few days ago, she grabbed Brady's pack after he checked his BS & started to chew & play with it. We stopped her & told her to "bring it" & then gave her a treat for giving it. Well, yesterday, she grabbed it again after she alerted me so I encouraged her to "take it to Brady". She took it to him & dropped it on his bed. We cheered & acted like she had saved him from a burning building (:D Well, about 30 minutes ago, she alerted Brady, came to me, alerted me so I grabbed Brady's pack & said "get your pack" (I put one of his old meters that looks exactly like the one he uses right now, in a place she can grab it). I told her "get it - take it to Brady'. She pranced like a horse to Bradys room & dropped it in his lap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Then she jumped on his bed, sniffed him like crazy, re-alerted him & then re-alerted me. We all got sooooo excited. She was so proud of herself. She was almost smiling. She ran straight to the refrigerator & sat her butt down & waited for a treat :D It was awesome. I'm so proud of her. It's the same feeling you have when your toddler uses the potty for the first time.
Sorry to ramble but I'm trying to cram all my excitement into a quick story ::o

car alert (16 replies)

Valliegirl — Fri, 05 Mar 2010 20:31:16 -0700

OH sorry Bridget I miss your question. Lucy will start whining in the back seat if my blood sugar is going out of range. If you have a scent sample in the front seat with Tammy buckled in in the back what will she do? Before I had a seat belt for lucy she would nudge my shoulder from the back seat. That work well except that she nudges harder and harder if I can't test so having her buckled in but whining is much safer for her and me.

Bell or Alarm for alert (no replies)

Valliegirl — Thu, 28 Jan 2010 20:02:52 -0700

I think some days I'll get too distracted in the PT clinic to remember to check in with lucy so I was trying to think of a better way for lucy to get my attention. I've considered some sort of a bell or quiet alarm but I couldn't work out the legistics so I wondered what you guys were doing with Tammy. I'm amazed that Tammy will be able to sit near the bleachers, watch everyone playing basketball and stay in a down. Thats impressive!

assertive alerts (2 replies)

Bridget — Wed, 27 Jan 2010 07:25:49 -0700

I definitely agree. Nothing horrifies me except the idea of him not waking up. It's funny, though....Brady is the one that wanted her alert to be to put her paws up on his chest. Lots of people warned against such an alert because it could knock him over if he were really low but we can't have it both ways. My scariest times as a mom are him driving & middle of the night so if Tammy errors on the side of "assertive".....I'll take it. We just try to keep her nails trimmed so that we don't get scratched. She's never knocked anybody over but we've all had a few scratches on our forearms. The school nurse has been alerted that way a couple of times this year & she LOVES it. Brady stops by her office on the way to lunch. She loves Tammy (anyway) but it's very clear to her because Tammy is so obedient the rest of the time. Tammy is a "tattle tell" & I love it . I know....since she is pretty stubborn when his blood sugar is low/high, maybe she can refuse to get in the car & try to pull him away?

training a dog to escalate alerts (1 reply)

Valliegirl — Thu, 21 Jan 2010 12:47:25 -0700

I'm glad that you've already decided that barking, pawing and licking is not the way to go. My thought and experience is that if you teach the dog how important the alerts are then they will bark or lick on their own if no one pays attention to the trained alert(like if your daughter doesnt respond to a bringsel at night). I practiced ignoring lucy when she nosed at me in the middle of night until she started licking my face so that if I didn't respond to the nosing because I was too low to recognize the alert she would know to lick my face.

Beginner's Questions : defining an alert signal (2 replies)

mindi — Sat, 16 Jan 2010 14:01:12 -0700

Brief intro: I'm a mother of four daughters ages 3 - 9 years (the 8 year old has had Type 1 diabetes for 3 years now) and my husband also has Type 1 diabetes. I have been with Echo Dogs White Shepherd Rescue for 6 years, training dogs for 20 years and owning German Shepherds for 27 years. In the past few months, my daughters diabetes has taken a serious turn for the worse. She is no longer recognizing lows until she's really low (sometimes doesn't recognize at all) and has went into seizures frequently. I can't afford to purchase an already trained DAD due to the enormous medical debt we've already incurred when we didn't have health insurance.

I have started studying everything I can about DADs in the hopes that with my training background, I can train a dog to help try to get more control over her diabetes. And less trauma and drama for everyone here as well. My 6 year old German Shepherd has alerted twice, (pushing at my daughter with her nose and whining, then running to me and whining, then going back to my daughter, etc). We kept saying "Chasey, leave her alone" but Chasey kept it up, so we decided to check my daughter's blood sugar. Both times she was very low, and shortly after we had given glucagon, she went into seizures. She's had many lows and highs though, so my dog doesn't alert consistently. Based on those alerts, I started looking for information on whether dogs could be trained to alert and found DADs.

I am currently looking for a GSD puppy to start to train as a DAD, but thought perhaps I could practice on Chasey while I'm looking for the right puppy. I do plan to attend the conference in May, but feel I need to start ASAP with how her diabetes has been fluctuating between severe highs and extreme lows (13 & 16 even). (Side note: yes, we are working with her new medical team to try to get her back into control, but as a mother, I would like to use any and every tool at my disposal to help her to live a better, healthier life.)

Tonight, Iris's blood sugar was 350, so I thought I would try to use this as a start. We've always told Chasey "Check Iris" (or whoever) and she would run to them, and run back and 'tattle" if they were doing something they shouldn't. So tonight I told her "check Iris" and had Iris blow in her face at that time, then she ran back to me and looked at me.

I like the "bringsel" method I've read about, but don't know much about what it actually is. I thought an extra OneTouch Mini case that we had might work for training, but she refuses to put the vinyl in her mouth. The most she will do is push it around on the floor. My plan to start was just to try to get her to smell my daughter, then (when the sugar is high or low) pick up the ____ and bring it to me (haven't figured out how to differentiate between high/low signals, but thought just getting her to alert to a problem by picking up something would be a start.

So....

1) What exactly is a Bringsel (material, how big, what's in it, etc) or is that just the name of the method, but I still need to know what exactly they grab?

2) Thoughts on something else - like a small plush pillow/toy perhaps- that she could grab as the signal instead (I'd rather avoid pawing, barking or licking as the signal - pushing/whining is only effective if I'm in the same room to see what she's doing)?

And just any other helpful tips in general to help me get started. I've done a lot of behavior and obedience training, but never scent training. I appreciate all the help anyone can give me. Thank you so much. I love this forum and look forward to learning and growing with all of you.

Mindi Fredrick

alert signal for on-the-go/ fast pace/ difficult terrain (2 replies)

minnesota.ann — Sat, 12 Dec 2009 06:38:55 -0700

Question for all.....
I need ideas for an alert that can be done by the dog while hiking in difficult terrain, jogging or walking fast. Of course the paw, wave, bow, bump need to be done from a stop. Even the bringsel would be hard for the dog to grab while moving at a fast pace or moving on difficult terrain when you need to watch where you are placing your feet. Having the dog cut in front or jump around in front of the diabetic could dangerously cause either to fall, especially a diabetic whose BS is going low. These are of course activities that "cause" blood sugars to drop and so I've been wanting to teach one that has been well thought out, so as to not have to un-teach later.....
Appreciate all thoughts on this.
Thanks

Training Two Alerts (9 replies)

Valliegirl — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 10:38:05 -0700

Bridget-I moved your question over here so everyone can find this topic as I'm sure its an important one. (Bridget's son's dog Tammy has been alerting for a few months?? with a single alert for both highs and lows and wondered how to start training for two alerts)

There probably be different opinions but heres my two cents- When I first started training lucy I taught her to "nose it" at my knee for a high and "touch it"(paw on my foot) for a low. Well lucy soon figured out that touching to touch my foot while we were walking through the mall was nearly impossible so she just nosed at me. She and I then built on this behavior so now lucy will nose me to alert, sit, I say "what is it?" and then she noses me for a high or waves/paws for a low. Another family is also doing one behavior for the alert followed by a "what is it?" command and then a high and low alert.

So i was thinking about you could teach two other behaviors to pair with the high or low scent. Then let tammy do her current alert followed by a sit and one of the two alerts. Ugh that sounded confusing. Did it make any sense? If you would like to try this I could write out steps to train it. I don't know what tammy's current alert is but would it be possible to just add a behavior to her current alert to indicate a low?

Ready for 2 alerts (no replies)

Bridget — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 13:59:57 -0700

Rachel......you're asking me (Miss Questions) if I like the Q & A ??? Of course I do!!

Speaking of questions...... (:D.....I don't know how to "start" teaching 2 different alerts. I'm so afraid to mess up Tammy's current alert (because it's working so well) but I have recently come to understand the importance of having 2. Tammy has gotten so good that she's about 30 - 40 minutes ahead of the glucometer. In the beginning, I was just thankful that she was alerting but, now, we have to wait 30 minutes to figure out which direction his BS is going before we can do anything. I know....I know......all of you talked about the importance of having 2 alerts but I was just overwhelmed at the time. We had to get one alert down-pat....first :D Remember.....we are not dog trainers so please "dumb-it-down" :S

how to train for different alerts (5 replies)

Wen — Wed, 12 Aug 2009 12:19:29 -0700

How did you train to give different alerts? Right now Cooper bumps my hands very aggressively and wags his tail for both. What other alerts do dogs do besides bringing my meter?

Night time alerting behavior (no replies)

leecherice — Mon, 12 Oct 2009 07:19:55 -0700

Ann, we also only have one alert. Remi bumps Deanna's hand when she is low. The lower she gets the harder he bumps and if he still doesn't get her attention he paws her. I like the paw except at night. Someone here told me to that he might hurt her and I never thought of that. She was right. He gets pretty aggressive at night because she won't wake up. He could scratch her to death and she would wake up the next morning and wonder what happened because she never woke up. Usually after a few minutes he gives up and goes back to sleep. He just started alerting to highs. We didn't train him to do this because I don't want him waking me up all night for a high. Lows I do want him to wake me for. Not that he does this yet but one day I know he will. All he does is sniff her a lot in around the face and he looks her in the face which is not normal Remi behavior. He alerts around 200. Since she isn't usually high we haven't worried about it and never encouraged his high alerts. Now we do. When you were talking numbers, I thought back and you are right about DADs keeping the severe lows back. She has only been in the 30-40 range 3 times since we have gotten him. Thank God!! I am so glad Lily is doing so well for you. I think DADs are amazing and couldn't imagine life with out one!!

Tammy's Alert Chain (5 replies)

Bridget — Tue, 15 Sep 2009 19:12:41 -0700

Sorry it's taken so long to answer - crazy weekend. As for Tammy's range, we've never set it because she has alerted him <90 & >180 since the first day they were together. She's always had a tight range on him. I agree....it is very stressful for Brady because after eating (even though he bolused before he started eating) he will be >180 for a little bit until his insulin has had time to "get busy". Should we make new high samples with BS > 300? Will this move her range just by using a higher blood sugar sample?

I previously mentioned that Tammy's alert is getting anxious & breaking her obedience (meaning refusing to stay in a "down" or refusing to "sit" or bumping Brady's legs if she's heeling). However, this proved to be a pain-in-the-butt for him his first week of school. They are on a block-system so their classes are 90 minutes long. When his BS is 200 & she refuses to stay "down" under his desk, it's very disruptive. As a result, Brady worked all weekend on her alerts. She naturally wants to put her paws up on him while he's sitting or standing so he decided to just go with what is natural for her. I am a little skeptical of him wanting her to put her paws up on him but he's very adamant. I'll have to admit, though, he's a 15 yr old teenage boy.....paying attention & details are exactly his thing so Tammy jumping on him (even smacking him up-side the head) might be necessary when he's a little "fuzzy" ::o What does Justin do in class when Duke refuses to stay down or jumps on him? What does Duke do in class to alert?

Also, I don't want to beat-a-dead-horse but please re-explain storing samples.....
We know nothing about pvc tubes & containers. I've been storing them in freezer bags & just recently started putting those freezer bags into a airtight plastic container. Is this sufficient to keep the samples fresh? We've also started throwing them away after about 3 times of using them.

Alerting on and on and on (1 reply)

minnesota.ann — Mon, 10 Aug 2009 20:39:16 -0700

While we are on the subject of alerting. I know that Lily is newly doing this, but she keeps alerting and alerting. I do realize even though I've just eaten it does take some time for my BS to come back up and same with a high, it does take some time to come back down. SO technically I am still low or high to HER, so I do keep treating her, is there such thing as OVER treating at this stage..??....My question is how long to treat, do I need to be concerned, do I need to be thinking about weaning...? I have tried to tell her I've got it under control, somehow she just doesn't believe me....:)

?false alerts? (10 replies)

Wen — Tue, 11 Aug 2009 18:27:06 -0700

Ida I have a question. Cooper alerts very well, but lately he has alerted to a 130, 157, 121 all either in my normal or very close. I understand when he alerts to a 200 or above then alerts aprox. every 50 that the sugar drops. With the above numbers they weren't going up because I checked like Ann about 15-20 min later. I don't mind being alerted but what should I do? I treat him then check, if it is normal, I tell him it's o.k. and thank you and pet him, no more treats. Now if he alerts to low or hi later he gets the extra treats and much more praise.

the path to lily's alerting (1 reply)

minnesota.ann — Sun, 09 Aug 2009 06:40:12 -0700

Thanks everyone, Ida, as to if I've been doing things differently, yes.......
I made all new scent samples, making sure to keep them pure. I used gauze mostly wiping the inside of my mouth, storing them in a glass canning jar, using plastic gloves to take them in and out. I made sure I tested my BS before practicing so I was neither high nor low so as not to confuse. I put the samples into a nylon then hid them mostly on me but once in a while on a chair in the other room. Then I said nothing unless she didn't find it. I practiced only twice per practice session. I made sure to use EVERY real time low and high but only twice. Important not to let one slip by.

I prompted by sticking my arm or leg near her and asking her to check/smell me (which I had previously already taught). I dropped the blowing into her face as she did not like that. Made sure I didn't leave a sample attached to me for very long thinking "normal" smell might invade the sample.

In checking for unconscious clues, I ended up moving my samples to a freezer in the basement as I realized she was cue-ing off the sound of the freezer opening and the top of the jar screwing off noises. I had to try to really watch what I was doing, as when practicing I would stare at her and walk slowly. I also noticed she was pawing when she would hear the meter beep so I had to turn the beep off all my meters.

When I am home I use real chicken gizzards as a very high value treat, she paws and we yell GOOD GIRL and run for the kitchen while she waits for the chicken gizzard, she is very excited. Of course cannot do that in public but it was good to get the excitement going at home. Biggest change of all was journaling so I could follow my BS when I got a paw at 85 I would set a timer for 15 min to see if I was indeed falling, most times I was so I would think it was a false alert when it wasn't. I also wrote what prompts I had to use to get her to alert to a real time alert. Where we were, what we were doing. I was surprised to not have done that earlier as Diabetics are all so used to writing down all that junk.
That is all I can think of now.

Lily is finally alerting! (4 replies)

minnesota.ann — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 11:33:52 -0700

OK everyone we now have lift off, yes Lily is finally alerting!!! We clearly have a paw, paw, paw, which is the alert I trained for and wanted. I do not know exactly what was the turning point, I wish I did.

For those who do not know me from Betheden. Here is the Reader's Digest version of our story. I am a 51 year old having had Type 1 for 22+ years. As we all know 20 years is when Type 1s who were previously doing well, start with the "unawareness", I do realize some people have "unawareness" from day one and I ache for those people. Anyways, I start hearing of these dogs that sense lows about 3 years ago. I contact many places and many trainers and find very little help. Most want me to get rid of my current dog and buy one of theirs. I happen to have a std. poodle many tell me they cannot do this. No one really offering my any hard facts, just many opinions and no help (I will not name names on this forum...). I am stubborn and have taught several poodles high levels of obedience. So, I think if this can be taught, I should be able. I start down the road myself. I get stuck several times. Thanks to Vince's original site and one stuck and very low point an angel named Ann from Betheden says she knows poodles can do this as she had already taught 3, she invites me to Texas. My hubbie & I leave for Texas almost the next day. Ida is also heaven sent and very patient. We all then encounter an unforeseen problem. My dogs by this time (I've gotten a 2nd std. poodle, Lily) have lived with me for too long without being taught from the very beginning (like Jessica is currently doing correctly) and now the highs & lows are just a part of "my" scent picture. Houston we have a problem, but kept at it and at it and at it.! With new ideas and new determination we have now turned the corner. I know we still have training forever, but we are farther than we were yesterday.

Just tonight before eating I get a distinct paw yes I'm 71 then after eating she was pawing me again and I thought no way can I be low, she just wants some treats, oh oh she just paws for treats, sadness surrounds me. BUT as you all suggested ALWAYS check & I was 66........!!!! Oh, my gosh exhilaration, I've watched it happen over and over during the class and hear your stories on this forum was so happy for all of you (jealous too) but it IS different when it happens to yourself.

So, I now know that she can do this and I also know low points are in the future but tonight I'm going to celebrate this high point and thank you all for being there when I needed help, just reading how everyone is doing has always helped even when I was reading through tears.

encouraging a night time alert (68 replies)

leecherice — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 07:42:03 -0700

Can anyone tell me how to get Remi to start alerting while he is sleeping? He alerts all day while we are out and about and then when we get home he is out! Sleeping!!! And he doesn't alert to her at night either. Though he will sniff her and alet to her if he is woken up, even at night (because I go and check her at 2am every night and I wake him up if she's low). He was more willing to check her last night than he has been. What makes the scent wake him up or does it not?

Different alerts for Highs and Lows : ?helpful? (4 replies)

SueB — Thu, 13 Aug 2009 07:02:38 -0700

Hi Rachel-- Thanks for the nice welcome and description of Mr. Darcy's alerts. Sounds like they work well for your family.

I was wondering: is it helpful to have different alerts for high vs. low BG? Seems like you would want to test either way, just treat differently.

Thanks again, and thanks for setting up this forum! Sue Barns

Hello, and paw alert (4 replies)

SueB — Wed, 04 Aug 2010 17:56:38 -0700

Hi-- I have just joined this forum, and am looking forward to getting to know you all! I am a service dog trainer working for an assistance dog program, and am just beginning to work on diabetes detection. In addition to starting to train some of our program dogs for diabetes alert, I am also helping a Type I gentleman self-train his own dog.

To get this topic going, I will describe what we have done so far to train this dog's alert. She was already licking our client when he started working with me, so we started with that. Unfortunately, that was not distinct enough an alert, and he was often missing it (maybe!) when he was low (it's hard to tell for sure, because he cannot feel his lows, and gets very foggy when he goes low). So, I coached him to train a paw alert. She now whacks him with a paw, after licking first. Lately, it has become clear (and by his own admission) that he may be ignoring the paw alert as well, so we are in the process of teaching her to jump up on him. Here's hoping THAT gets his attention!

Looking forward to hearing other approaches-- Sue Barns, ADW Instructor/Trainer, New Mexico